‘Thé Great Reopening’

Full "Immunity" starts to kick in 2-3 weeks after the second vaccination dose. If we had been vaccinating on the 3 weeks recommended schedule, you'd be looking at late February to mid-March - or up to Easter for the majority of the vulnerable. With the 13 week schedule, you are looking at mid-May for anyone getting their first jab today.

 

Can't see anything really happening, it's impossible not feel for small businesses though as they are forced to close and see supermarkets continuing to trade.

 

If I ran a business, I'd open up. I'd put social distancing measures in place (you know, like the ones that were considered acceptable throughout most of last year) and leave it up to customers to make their own decision as to whether they want to visit or not.

I mean obviously, I'd be terrorised and fined by the Gestapo. Honestly though, I wouldn't pay the fine. They could arrest me, I'd go on hunger strike. Sod them. What is happening is unbelievable. Though, I think what annoys me the most is that the majority of people seem to yearn to be told what to do. I really do give up.

Obviously all of this would make me a murderer, in the eyes of the government and the NHS.

It should be up to YOU to determine the level of risk you are willing to take. If you live with vulnerable people, or you're vulnerable yourself, it makes absolute sense to limit your contact with other people. And I'm sure everyone would rally around those people and help them out. I'd be the absolute first. You have to wonder why we didn't spend time and money on developing systems to help the vulnerable. But you can't keep millions of people under house arrest. It's not fair however anyone tries to sell it.

 

It's not up to YOU to detemine the level of risk my grandparents are willing to take though.

 

I read this too, but surely for the shops and bars to open up, the supply chain has to aswell, wholesalers, breweries etc, cant see them all doing it to be honest, people are getting proper p****d off though...

 

Providing they are of sound mind nor is it up to you to determine the level of risk that they are willing take. Its down to them. I believe it is called personal responsibility.

 

I've said this a million times but it all falls down when you allow someone to take 'personal responsibility' (i.e. do whatever the heck they want) and then they get on a bus with/go to work with etc. someone who lives with someone vulnerable who has no choice but to get on that bus and go to work as it's only the vulnerable person who is able to shield, not them even though they live with them. Short of SuperTyke's idea of forcing all vulnerable people to live in giant warehouses, people 's lives are intertwined and letting one person do whatever they want has an impact on everyone else's safety.

 

They are all isolating as they have been doing for 10 months. However they do need family support to do shopping, cleaning, washing, hospital visits etc and the more prevelant the virus is, the more chance they have of catching it via their support mechanisms. As much as some on here would like to tell us, it's practically impossible to completely isolate from the world and, in turn, the virus.

 

My in laws next door neighbour died from covid late last year. He hadn't gone out at all and his only contact with people were carers coming to his house.

 

Lots of people who live with vulnerable people have had to go to work throughout. No solution exists that will 100% protect everyone.

 

I'm not determining that at all. It should be up to them. Are you saying they're not permitted to make their own decisions? It reminds a bit of Brexit. The old were not fit to think for themselves and have a vote.

Also, if they deem it too dangerous to go outside, does that mean everyone else has to stay in? I'm not dismissing their health and wellbeing, but it works both ways.

My grandmother had COVID. She's 88 and in a nursing home. She had a cough for a couple of weeks. I was as concerned as anyone else would be. But I still didn't want to force everyone to stay at home. That would make me, what, a dictator?

RE your other post. I agree. It's brilliant your family are helping your grandparents out with shopping etc. That's the best thing they could have done, if they think its too risky for them. Why couldn't we have mobilised a volunteer army for the vulnerable? Thousands volunteered to help the NHS in the first wave, I'm sure millions would have helped out the vulnerable.

You can't completely mitigate the risk. But this is the approach the government seem to want to take. And it's doing far more harm than good.

 

You're not wrong. The correlation with Brexit is uncanny.

 

I agree. Both Brexit and lockdown have been largely supported by a selfish older generation who don't care a fig for the damage those policies cause future generations.

 

The NHS is overwhelmed as it stands even under lockdown. Do you not think it is highly likely to get even worse if we all went back to normal and used the "common sense" approach??

 

Wirral, please...... lol!

 

So overwhelmed that we are yet to use the nightingales? We were told that the nightingales would be staffed by the army to alleviate the hospitals as and when needed. If the hospitals are overwhelmed, why are we not using them?

 

Firstly, some hospitals are overwhelmed, not all. But what about the Nightingale hospitals? Why is it overwhelmed when pretty everything else has been cancelled? I think the figure I saw last was that 30,000 people were in hospital with COVID. In a country with a population of not far off 70 million. If 30,000 overwhelms it then it needs serious looking at. What are the demographics, too? They're mostly 60+ with underlying health conditions.

I'm not being dismissive of the virus and the pain and suffering it is causing some people. My point is that it could have been handled a lot better. We should have a system whereby people can still have their cancer treatment while people get treated for COVID.

 

People are starting to get desperate with no income and/or no way to earn anything and its going to come to lose the business or risk a fine - its wrong the government can remove your right to earn a living to put food on the table. I am also noticing a lot of crime happening right now - 3 out of 4 neighbours all being burgled in the last week, cars getting nicked a lot - to commit other crimes a lot of the time and folk getting mugged in normally safe areas. This is only going to get worse - a lot worse - when business are no longer there to employ people because they have had to shut down.

 

It should have absolutely been handled better, I agree. We can't magic up NHS staff to man the nightingales though due to successive Tory cuts.