Ashes 2023

Exactly this. Stokes’ captaincy was brilliant until that point. No way Root should’ve carried on against two left handers with the new ball available

 

The keeping is an issue. If England want flat wickets to go with this new playing style, they need to take their chances.

Won’t happen but I’d bring in Foakes for Crawley or Duckett and Ahmed for Ali.

 

I think Broad would?

 

As the Aussies got within about 40 runs of victory I said to my mates that if England win now, the early declaration would have won us the game (by allowing us time to take all 10 wickets), but if we lost it will be argued that it cost us the game. It was a very fine margin really, as when the 8th wicket fell, nobody expected Cummins and Lyon to see out the match.

The declaration was certainly bold, and when you are playing a team as good as the Aussies, doing something to unsteady them and get in their heads is not a bad thing (see also giving the ball to Brooks!). Their openers were definitely shaky, and if it had led to us picking up a wicket or two it would have been heralded as a stroke of genius.

There were other things after the declaration that cost us too though, like a few dropped catches, Ali’s injured finger, a few cheap dismissals and, at the end, not taking the new ball straight away, although as Root had just taken a wicket that decision looks a lot worse in hindsight than it did at the time. But as we got 44 runs for the last two wickets in the second innings, I guess not declaring might have got us a draw at least.

 

I think we threw this match away. Should have batted on until we were all out first innings.

 

Bazball all well and good but it should be played with an element of common sense. Some of our dismissals including Bairstow and Ali in the first innings and Root in the second gifted the game to the Aussies.

 

Stokes explained the declaration in terms of a tired Aussie team not expecting to get at the end of the day maybe being susceptible to a couple of wickets that evening. Didn't happen and added 15 runs to their total. It was very close, we were in top for the majority of the game and if Khawaja hadn't been so dogged could have picked up an early win. Smith and Labuschagne look ropey which I wasn't expecting, we've a lot to be confident about imo.

 

Does Foakes count cos he would !
Anderson has had a poor match for him but he would definitely get in.
Broad is at the top of his form and may get in.
As an all rounder I’d choose Stokes over Green and Bairstow should get in over Head.

 

I said when we declared it was shocking, we should have been 350 for 4/5, no hindsight here

Post #108.

 

Yeah it was those daft wickets that put the thought in Stokes' head. Had we been only 4 or 5 down. I reckon he'd have batted on. However, Root was seeing it like a beach ball as was Robinson. I reckon they'd have been good for another 40 or 50.

 

Nasser was saying yesterday that it was one of those games where a controversial decision would be ultimately classed as brilliant or irresponsible and how right he was.
As you say, if Khawaja hadn’t been as dogged etc….
Close games are always full of “ ifs “ but the most important things are that it was good to watch and the teams are well matched.

Lords here we come !

 

2-0 Australia. We never beat them at Lord's. Just blown a win on one of our strongholds.

 

You’re certainly a glass half empty guy ( when it comes to cricket anyway )

Repeat ten times quickly …
We will win at Lords

 

Terrible declaration with Root still out there clubbing them everywhere. Hope he learns from his mistake. I'd have preferred it to have them come out fielding for a few overs on the second day and catch them cold.

 

Well I’m very pleased for you, but what has that got to do with letting Joe Root bowl another over with the old ball?!?

 

A ludicrous declaration, which has come back to slap him/us in the face. This is Australia in the Ashes of course, we know what a great team they are. Just don't take clever chances like this, when it's hard enough to beat them in the first place.

 

The declaration was two thirds and a bit of the way through day 1, and the match ran for the full 5 days. I don't think it would have made any difference at all, with hindsight. Full disclosure: I loved it at the time. We all know that he did it looking for the wicket in the evening session, and if just one had come then most of us would have been talking about how good the call was. I certainly don't think the Aussies will be in their dressing room tonight saying "it was a good job he declared on day 1, or else we might not have won it".

Australia played really well in my opinion, but perhaps England's bowlers should be expected to see off a few tail-enders for 40-ish? if we're complaining about captaincy then maybe Stokes should have taken the new ball a bit earlier, but then I was sitting around moaning about that when Root took his wicket...

 

I think we’re forgetting too that even with the declaration we had a 7 run lead after the first innings. It was a combination of factors that lost us the game, the main one being Cummins and Lyon’s brilliant stand. It was the second highest unbeaten 9th wicket stand in the 4th innings of an Ashes Test match, and the Aussies’ highest successful run chase in the Ashes since 1948. When the 8th wicket fell, Australia were 12/1 to win.

 

I agree, but if Bairstow has a semi-competent game behind the stumps we win that easily. Fine margins.