British values

That's one reference, yes!

 

You find patriotism odd, but not support for a football team…. Based only on where it was formed, or who your family supported?

The other stuff. “We” and a large part of the world did the same stuff, (some still do). Let’s give some sizeable mentions to the French and the Spanish… However, as ever the Brits were particularly good at it. Not that it’s anything to be proud of.

“We” as an island have been violated over the years by other countries as well.

 

- eating foreign food
- drinking foreign beer
- driving foreign cars
- going on foreign holidays
- complaining about foreigners

 

Football is a sport where people try and kick a bag of wind into an old bag of onions. Completely odd! And ultimately at the end of the day its throw away folly. The furthest reaches of tribalism within football can mimic the furthest reaches of patriotism... So you've touched on a good simile for sure there, whether intentional or not.

I did say other nations committed violations too. You forget the Dutch.

As for how we've been violated... Certainly not for a long time. We've certainly not had occupations like our European friends endured and I'm pretty sure British slaves have not yet flooded the market.

But yes, I find it odd when people rally around a flag based on where they were dropped as a sproglet and bend its meaning to whatever notion they want it to mean... However true or delusional it may actually be.

 

Best answer yet!

 

They're not. They're all corporate clones programmed to hit targets. Association with plebs delays bin collection and replacement and gives no upside to the business model. Friendliness is anti-productivity.

 

Occupations, the Romans certainly did a bit of occupying in Britain. The Normans weren’t bad either. The vikings did as well. History is full of it all over the world. But we live in a period where there will be a completely different population in 50-100 years.. So I’m not penitent for the ills of past, as 1 it wasn’t me and 2 the values of society and what’s decent have changed over the time.

The patriotism thing in my opinion stems from the basic human need to belong. Whether that to a piece of land, a football team, a flag, a message board, etc.. belonging and family affect moods and personal mental health.

 

Tribalism is a natural human condition. Unfortunately it has rarely worked as a survival technique for any empire. The successful ones over the centuries were a lot broader in their scope. It's hard to find many of them that worked for the masses, including the Soviet Union & the USA TBH. I think the American Indians were probably ones that did, but could not cope with the massive fire power & imported diseases that they had no immunity to. That is no doubt the story of many more advanced civilisations than the one we currently abide in.

 

We are moving to a global tribe now. Which is really irking the big powers. So they make new boundaries. I mean I see people arguing whether they are apple or Samsung…

But being part of a team or tribe is generally more productive as a race. So does have some bonuses.

 

I forget the concept, but years ago alongside nlp and influence... I'll call them learnings, I picked up the suggested balance of character cohorts. You're right, belongers are by far the biggest group (I think it suggested around 83% were placed in that group). You then had mismatchers (who have the need to be different from the majority) and balanced, who feel neither need to belong or be different. The latter being the least common cohort.

I did think you might be hinting at roman and viking occupations which obviously occurred centuries ago and should be out of the modern mindset. I've often wondered if our more current outlooks and yearning for superiority that we can often see in popular discourse is derived from more recent conquests of others rather than our very aged defeats to marauders.

I'd also suggest likes hobbies and activities, especially from youth will be built from locality and accessibility to start with and then form habit latterly. Whereas a country is a land mass and a notional or geographic line probably created from mass murder at some stage or the natural formed geology of an island. As you rightly say, values and society will shift over time. Some for good, some less so. And perhaps its that transience that causes ructions with those who have become accustomed to belonging in a certain time with a certain environment. Interesting to debate.

 

It doesn't help that we are given such a poor teaching of our own history. We talk about the last invasion of England in 1066, but forget the Welsh & Scottish incursions - as far south as Derby - and completely ignore the "Glorious Revolution".

 

You're right... I only took history to the 3rd year because it just felt dull. All I can remember were they talked about dinosaurs for pretty much a year and then an inordinate amount of time on Tollund Man!

I don't recall anything about the civil war being touched on and nothing about empire or global history.

 

Very true and even the 1066 invasion is a grey area as king Edward had promised the throne to William the 1st but supposedly granted it to Harold on his deathbed.Billy The Norman got the hump and took it by force but always claimed it was his by right..I agree with DannyWilsonLovechild, we learned about the American civil war but not our own. I often think were embarrassed about our history due to our Empire building. many European countries did it but we seem to be tainted by it more than the rest. Obviously subjugation of other people should never be celebrated but only by talking about it can you teach how wrong it is..

 

And “No Milk Today” Herman’s Hermits.