Building a new Barnsley team for years to come......

So do I
A win tomorrow will help

 

I am from a different generation to most contributors on this forum. My first season was the first ever season that Barnsley FC played 4th tier football (1994/95). In my second season, after 10 games we were actually bottom after 10 games. For the following 10 seasons or so, the team hovered between 3rd and 4th tiers. This gives me an entirely different perspective than the more recent generation, for whom 2nd tier football has been the norm. This generation look back at the history of our club and claim a divine right to be in the 2nd tier. For my part, I see no difference between this reasoning, and the reasoning of the Wednesday fans, that their club is massive. No club has any right to play at any level, or indeed to win games against teams that fans are accustomed to be seeing playing at a lower level.
The more recent generations of Reds supporters think that their loyalty is being severely tested at the moment by the poor results and lower quality players. Let me tell you that if you think that your loyalty is being tested, you are no more than a lightweight. Imagine being 92nd, and still going to every game, both home and away. Imagine sticking with a manager for 10 years (John Steele), a manager who presided over the managed decline into the lower leagues because there was not enough cash coming in through the turnstiles to support any other policy.
In the end, and this is particularly true now that spending on wages is limited to a percentage of revenue in the lower leagues, the better supported clubs will be able to pay the wages required by the better players, and this will help those clubs to find their true level in the league structure. Only if supporters continue to turn up in numbers over a long period will the finances continue to support the aim of a return to the second tier.
Anyone who expected a quick return to second tier football has failed to analyse the plight of those clubs who have made the journey down to this division before us. It is now even more difficult, because what most fans perceive as the culling of the dross from a failed last 2nd tier campaign, was actually a reduction in outgoings necessitated by the rules applying to 3rd tier team budgets. Is it a reasonable expectation to replace players on a 2nd tier wages structure with players on a 3rd tier wages structure and to expect an improvement across the board? Is it reasonable to expect a manager to do so given the time constraints imposed on him because most of his budget was not granted until just before the season because our major wage earner delayed his departure? I think not. That late departure has meant that the team reconstruction was only partially completed by the close of the transfer window, and effectively cannot be completed until the start of next season.
I define patience as the ability to overcome disappointments. As the ability to look for credible explanations for the team/team management disappointing. As the ability to set aside those disappointments and to keep believing in spite of short term reverses, that if the long term policy is right, then results will eventually follow. Like everyone else, I was caught up in the preseason euphoria and I expected a good season. Unlike a few, I am able to set aside the disappointments and put them down to poorly managed expectations. This league is better than I remembered and it is going to take longer than I expected for us to find our feet, but at least we have the right man at the helm. It is not important to me whether he is better than Flitcroft or Hill, because at the end of the day, any manager can be successful if he is given time and a competitive budget. With his record at this club, Danny Wilson deserves both the time and the budget. He also deserves our patience.

 

I agree with most of that, but in 94 we were definitely not in the 4th division ! I think you have got your years mixed up mate. Surely you meant 60`s ?

 

Great post, RR.

 

You are correct. I put it down to the early onset of senility.

 

10 games? Oh come on Whitey, that like saying we only game Flitcroft about 15 games, both have had in excess of 40 games and Danny's figures are the worst of the two. We are going round in circles here and no I don't think we should have stuck with Flitcroft, be we certainly haven't seen the required improvement we were wanting by a long shot.

 

An enjoyable read but:

" but at least we have the right man at the helm. It is not important to me whether he is better than Flitcroft or Hill, because at the end of the day, any manager can be successful if he is given time and a competitive budget. With his record at this club, Danny Wilson deserves both the time and the budget. He also deserves our patience"

If any manager can be successful with time and the budget how come we have had so many over the last few years?
You may say because they were not afforded the adequate time to allow our fortunes to change.
The reason they went is because they just were not getting results and we were losing the plot. If we had afforded these managers any more time we would have been relegated long before we were.
So the fact is managers are not guaranteed to be successful even with time and money. They have to have the ability as well.
Danny Wilson will be afforded time, budget and patience but if results and manner of performances continue to disappoint over a significant time frame he will ultimately go the way of his predecessors.

 

There is little doubt that you are right. Danny Wilson will eventually be sacked by Barnsley FC. All managers who do not leave the club because they are offered a better job at a higher level will eventually be sacked. It is a sad truth of football that only the supporters show any loyalty whatsoever.

It is interesting how the careers of Keith Hill and Danny Wilson have mirrored one another. Both were very successful in their first jobs. Both achieved promotions for their respective clubs, and buoyed by their success, both decided to move on to see if they could replicate their success at a higher level. Both were unable to replicate their original success and the lack of time and inadequate budget played a part in their failure. They have both returned to the scene of their original success and were greeted with great initial enthusiasm by the respective fans. However, they have had mixed results. Of course, expectations of the respective sets of supporters were different, and one has had much longer to turn things around than the other. One is still regarded as a hero because he has once again given the supporters a level of success beyond their limited expectations. The other has yet to turn things around and has under-performed against supporter's expectations. An outsider might consider that the better manager is the one who has returned to repeat his success. Another outsider might consider that the only difference is that the second manager needs more time in order to turn things around and that the supporters' expectations are unrealistic. Personally, I am happy with my original statement, "any manager can be successful if he is given time and a competitive budget". Are you prepared to re-examine your expectations in order to test they are reasonable in the light of my original posting.

 

You and I have had our differences in the past, and perhaps will continue to do so in the future. However, that sir is an excellent post and it's only right and proper that I acknowledge such a top notch contribution from yourself.
Very well said.

 

This thread was about team/squad building. I gave my opinion on that. I'll leave others to constantly question the managers position, be it after 5, 10, 40 or 50 games. No idea why every thread you enter ends up down the same one way street, where you repeat yourself continually, to the point of it making you look anti-Danny. Because apparently, all you lot on here who are anti-Danny keep telling me you aren't. Very strange.

 

Your kind words are much appreciated. Thank you

 

You're welcome.

 

My expectations are reasonable, obviously from my own point of view , and I totally respect the contents of your above mentioned posts which contain many valid points.

 

Maybe he is anti Wilson maybe not and the same goes for all the contributors to this forum, but while the team serves up sub standard rubbish, people will come on this forum to express concern in one form or another as they did when Hill Flicker and Davey were managers.
The aforementioned managers all received their fair share of criticism on this board as any future manager will if we deliver dire football.
The problem we have with Wilson is that he was here before and people assume his appointment will result in more success.
Red Rain made a point "With his record at this club, Danny Wilson deserves both the time and the budget"
He deserves the time and budget but his previous time at the club counts for nothing and should not allow him any more time than any other manager to show he is the right man for the job.
I don't give a damn who's in charge whether its Wilson or anyone else. All I expect is a decent standard of football to enjoy watching and signs we are making progress. A mid table finish for me this season would be progress and would create a good platform for next season.
At the current point in time poor displays outnumber the good ones by a large percentage and the side are hovering around the relegation zone. I expect an improvement on both points before Christmas if that is not too much to ask.

 

I have no problem with people discussing things related to results, be it the manager or his players. None at all. What I don't particularly enjoy is the myriad posts from such as yourself like the one above, posted three and four times a day in every thread you enter. Yet, after a good result last weekend your posts were far less frequent, and contained little more than a sentence. And so I take what I take from that.

I've been a bigger critic of previous managers than you are now of Danny. So that's not an issue. That is indeed the point of a forum. To get things off your chest. But I don't understand why folk are so quick to heap pressure on a manager who has had to rebuild his whole team on a much reduced budget in such a short space of time, just 10 weeks and 10 games into a season. Especially a bloke who delivered this club one of its finest hours.

You say you don't give a damn who's in charge, yet your posts on here are all related to Danny so it's obvious you do give a damn. I can only urge you to chill art, again, and just support the club in its endeavours. Life's too short.

 

Sorry Whitey that is utter tosh and i resent your assumption and comments that I do give a damn.
The best thing you can do is put me on ignore and I will do with you.
All you do is assume and the 1st paragraph of your post seems to sum you up.
You seem to know whats in my head better than I do!!
You assume and at times you can be quite tedious.

 

It's not utter tosh though is it. Plenty of posters notice and comment on the lack of posts from certain people when we win and also the same views posted on threads that aren't really about the original post. We all support the team, there is no doubt about that however some need to enjoy it now and again!

 

So if you don't give a damn who the manager is, why are you always questioning his position? That makes no sense, mate. That'd be like me saying I don't care what the weather is like then complaining that I've not taken a coat out and now I'm wet through.

Agree with you on the tedious bit.


Won't be putting you on ignore though. I like arguing with you.

 

There were plenty of post from me last week after the Rochdale game giving praise.
As regards enjoying it perhaps that's the reason i didn't renew my season ticket .
Last week was a pleasant change.
I'm hoping for something to enjoy this afternoon.