Corbyn is a leader..

I tend to take the Glenda Jackson view on Thatcher

 

Sturgeons soon to be the second woman in Scotland.

Behind Ruth Davidson...

 

I disagree with her politics but she is also very impressive

 

I'll tell thi what

There's some utter ****** spouted by the usual suspects on this thread that have no intention of considering the matter with any objective view in the slightest.

Also plenty of people who cannot see beyond the media / establishment onslaught of misinformation and misrepresentation of Corbyn.

Anyhow, I believe he's got more metal and substance than any other politician in Westminster and it will be interesting to see how it pans out in the long run and how a social media driven movement can take its "narrow spectrum" of opinion to the country to counter what has clearly been a concerted attempt to destroy him.

If an essentially decent, largely centrist politician, with sensible policies which are largely supported by the public (such as rail nationaisation, halting NHS privatisation and public investment in housing) cannot make a positive electoral impact, then my friends, the future is bleak indeed (unless you are on the corporate / westminster gravy train)

Sithi

This place stinks.

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

"largely centrist"

Got a belly laugh out of that one.

Keep em coming.......

 

I personally believe we'd be in a lot better place with him in charge but you've only got to look at the last 20 years to know that who gets elected is based on who the best public speaker is & not what there policies are. Sad but true

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

To be fair, some of those posting in this thread are folk I'd not trust if they told me water was wet.

I'm left of centre in my outlook on life. So I'm never going to vote for the Tory party. And they seem further right than usual now May's in charge. I wasn't old enough to vote when Blair won in '97. But I do remember as a 15 year old lad brought up by a proper old-skool Labour father, him telling me that it was all ******** and watered down Tory ideals. He was spot on. Labour under Blair moved away from the social principles of the party, they even took us into illegal wars. That allowed the Tories back in with the fresh-faced Cameron who seemed a quite centrist leader, for a conservative at least. And as much as I found him to be a massive failure, he wasn't as bad as Thatcher and will be seen as bloody lovely compared to May too, give it time.

In that time we were given Brown and Milliband as Labour leaders. Nobody had a ******* clue what their plans were. They seemed to agree with the Tories on so much. And so when Milliband quit after a shocking result at the last election, the Labour members found a Leader who would offer a real alternative. But that didn't go down well with many Labour MP's who fear change. They enjoy their expenses. They aren't interested in the party, or the people, they are in it for themselves. They offer up no alternatives.

And of course the media (run by Tories) and big businesses are against Corbyn. Because he brings change.

People can bring up links to Iran or the IRA, they can talk about him hating Jews etc. They can call it ridiculous that he wants us to disarm our nukes. They can say it's stupid to try and communicate with ISIS.

But the current government and Labour's before it, all in bed with Saudi Arabia and the USA. The biggest terrorist and inhumane nations on the planet. So we need to keep our nukes pointed at Russia apparently. Because peace cannot be negotiated without them. Apparently. Despite 96% of the countries on Earth having no nukes. Countries not at war or killing each other, invading other countries etc. Vast majority are quite peaceful, funnily enough.
As for ISIS, they are they by-product of Labour under Blair kissing American arse and joining an illegal war and invasion of Muslim nations, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent men, women and children in order to take the natural produces and control the region for their own financial and economic gain. Gains that haven't ever helped the UK or USA, because we've been in ******* recessions since. Blair has ironically been a middle east peace envoy and ambassador. He's worth £60,000,000. But no.

No. That bloody Corbyn is awful, wanting to create a fairer and more equal society, where nobody is left behind.

I like to think I'm a good bloke. I think Corbyn and his Labour ideals are good. Hence my support for him.

Owen Smith and Angela Eagle before him are pissing into the wind I'm afraid.




Don't get me started on our 'mates' across the pond and their election. Christ.

 

Corbyn is a dopper
Gordon is a moron

 

Joined Labour because of Corbyn. Feel deeply let down over his efforts in the referendum. Feel as though he is more concerned over keeping his own clique's power than the survival and championing of the party as a whole. I also hate the cultish way that any criticism of this makes you a tory Which is divisive and self destructive. Although I support most of his policies I'm not convinced that Corbyn will win the voters over in places like Barnsley and more worryingly I worry that the hard left are not interested in parliamentary democracy and power. One of my momentum friends said as much- ' I don't care about power. '

 

As a lifelong labour voter, I now look like abstaining for the first time in my life and i know a number that feel like me. I see Corbyn's lips move and I hear the appropriate words but I am not convinced. The party lay out the way forward and he does his own thing by not showing enthusiasm for things he does not wholeheartedly agree with. i.e the referendum. He said he was for remain, but his demeanour throughout the campaign said different.

Less than 2% of the electorate are members of a political party so the other 98% + are there to be wooed (albeit many will have fixed views). I cannot for the life of me see Corbyn and his mates doing much consumating.

 

What a stupidly misogynistic thing to say. Idiotic. So, a woman who may happen to be a feminist cannot spout what she thinks is a good point without having her sexuality ridiculed then? Sick!

 

And why do you assume Corbyn is anti-democratic? Please provide an example. As far as I know he won on a democratic platform last year as Labour leader and if he loses this year he'll accept the result and won't try and do a purge......As to the Neo-Communist point, again please provide an example or tie it in with the 'Stalinist anti-democracy' comment. And as leader and standing up against Trident, war, injustice and lack of investment, isn't that exactly the kind of things a Labour leader should be doing ?

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

What an excellent post mate. Couldnt have said it better myself. Well, actually, I wouldnt have used the phrase 'bloody Corbyn,. There was no need was there?
Cheers and well said.

 

I was a lifelong Labour voter myself. Last time I voted Green even though I knew they had no chance. You have to look at your core values and vote for what you believe in at the end of the day.

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

I agree with much you say about the USA: a morally and politically bankrupt stain on the western world. Corbyn though just doesn't sit right with me.

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

I like Corbyn. He supports traditional Labour policies and values. The ideas he puts forward and the policies he has or has t supported were pretty centrist before the Labout Party swung hard to the right under Kinnock, Blair and Brown. To portray him as soon some of hard left person is a rewrite of history. He supports core Labour values. He is centre left.

The media believed these values had been defeated believed there was no one left to speak for working class people. They happily demonise working class people as chavs they patronise us. In the last 30 years hard working working class people have been transformed by the media from 'salt of the earth' through ''enemies within' to chavs or benefit scroungers ( ignoring the fact that the benefits bill is largely spent on propping up capitalism for those who are in work but not paid enough to live).. We have destroyed our manufacturing base we have sold of our utilities we have closed our mines and steelworks we have replaced well paid but demanding jobs with low paid jobs that the state has to prop up. We have nullified trade unions so they have become irrelevant. We have taken away the voice of the working classes. This has opened up space for divisive frankly racist parties like UKIP and formerly the BNP to wheedle their way into working class areas blaming 'foreignness' and 'otherness' for the nations problems. Poorly paid job in Capita's call centre blame EU migrant workers not the Chief Executive on his ridiculous pay claiming he can barely get by on his 13 million quid a year. Queue at the doctors/hospital due to underfunding blame foreigners ( the same foreigners that keep the NHS working.

Corbyn can fill this vacuum and put the real issues back on the agenda. The ridiculous levels of Executive pay. The stupid decisions to privatise the rail service. That's why the right wing press are scared of him. It's why they look to ridicule him. Because he is raising issues that they do not want raised putting ideas of fairness and respect for working people back on the agenda. Suggesting that one of the richest countries on earth should be able to properly fund hospitals and schools and look after the old and weak. Suggesting that fighting illegal wars and wasting money on propagating the myth of nuclear deterrence( there have been more wars since 1945 thAn any period in history) is not the way forward.

In terms of leadership or electability i think if left to follow his own interests and freed of the constraints of the extreme right within his own party he will be fine. The important thing however is to raise issues to raise debate. Over the last 30 years the Uk has swung from a centrist country to a wildly right wing one. The victories of working people in 1945 after they elected a Labour government to make sure that there fallen colleagues did not die in vain are being unpicked.

My grandad something of a war hero was prouder of the NHS than any of his own exploits. Just before he died when he was in hospital he looked round and said we did this we built this my dead mates made this country better for all not just a small privileged minority. They want it back to how it was before little education for the poor. Charity hospitals. A broken poor and easily manipulated almost slave workforce. Nothing I have seen since then has shown him to be wrong. Corbyn defends this faith. He attacks those who betray the ideas of 1945 and a better life for all. Regardless of anything else these ideas must live on there must be hope for all.

Onwards and upwards.

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

This

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

And in the interests of balance:

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...y-corbyn-no-leader-labour-mps-accused-abusing

This nails it for me!

 

Corbyn is a leader and there are many different high profile leaders that have done great things and also not so great. Leadership and success don't automatically go together. We have to think of the future for our country and our town. Will for example our mining heritage support a modern version and back fracking in Barnsley? But the big question isn't is he a leader, the question is is he a good enough leader with good enough values and policy to win a general election. After all that's the primary objective right now.

 

Re: I'll tell thi what

yes much of Corbyn's rhetoric is admirable. I was to the left many moons ago but have aged into centrism. However i'm afraid i cannot get past the fact he actively supported the IRA. There is a huge difference between verbalising one's opposition and personally appearing at provo rallies and commemorative events. As one who grew up during the 'troubles' and witnessed the callous barbarism of the IRA (indescriminate bombing, torture, knee-capping etc) this is hard to get past. For me it shows an emotional detachment, a coldness, innocent victims being seen as collateral damage. It is understandable why Corbynites are quick to try to dissociate him from this.