Hillsbrough

Where is your information from that Liverpool fans turned up late, drunk and without tickets? Because all official inquiries in to Hillsborough found that didn't happen and was not a cause, so where are you getting that from?

 

You've got proof of that because the inquiry didn't find any

 

Right,
Barnsley vs Forest, FA Cup Semi Final at Hillsborough, tickets sold out and you can't get one, most of you're mates have got one and they say you might be able to get in, do you go? Of course you do.

Then when a Police man opens a gate and lets people in, are you going to stand there or go and watch us?

 

So that absolves them of any blame does it?

 

Bell. End. (I don't think I've ever been abusive to anyone on this site but that warranted it.)

 

Kin'ell thats a new un l've heard. In the footage l saw there was what looked like Elvis, running across the terraces.

 

There were accusations that the behaviour of the Liverpool fans contributed to the disaster. These centered around consumption of alcohol before the game and attempts to enter the ground without a ticket. Although Lord Taylor acknowledged that these aggravated the situation, they were only secondary factors.

Witness estimates of the number of fans who were drunk varied from a minority to a large proportion of the crowd. Although it was clear that many fans had been drinking, Lord Taylor unequivocally stated that most of them were: "not drunk, nor even the worse for drink". He concluded that they only formed an exacerbating factor.

The possibility of fans attempting to gain entry without tickets or with forgeries contributing to the disaster was also suggested. South Yorkshire Police also suggested that the late arrival of fans amounted to a conspiracy in order to gain entry without tickets. However, analysis of the electronic monitoring system, Health and Safety Executive analysis and eyewitness accounts showed that the total number of people who had already entered the Leppings Lane End was far below the capacity of the stand. Additionally, eye witness reports suggested that tickets were easily available on the day of the game, and that tickets for the Leppings Lane End were still on sale from Anfield until the day before the game. The report dismissed the conspiracy theory.

 

At the end of the day, whatever the other contributory factors, if the police had kept control - which is their first and foremost job - there might have been some unhappy punters, p'd off television companies and even some arrested Scousers, but no deaths.

 

North stand, Kop side. Any reason for that question or just nosey?

 

So as I said, a contributory factor....it's quoted in there as being so.
Letters from senior police offficers state it was a factor. As I said, maybe not the main factor, but it was there.

So if the Taylor Report is what happened, and the Liverpool families accept all this, why are they dragging it all back up again? It's a witch hunt, they don't want justice, they want what they perceive to have happened as justice. I agree with Boris Johnson on one point - Liverpool = self pity city. I've called it that myself for years.

 

It didn't happen!

I'm asking you again, as someone who is usually very level headed, where have you got this information from and are you sure of it, because the Justice Taylor Report is very clear in stating that what you have said was not a factor.

 

Arsehole.

JUSTICE FOR THE 96

 

What the hell are you reading?

It clearly says that fans turning up without tickets was not a factor!

Jesus

 

Wish I had a scanner. There's an article in this months Red Issue (Man Utd fanzine) and it gives you quotes from Phil Neal and Kenny Dalglish from their recollections of that day. They vary quite vastly, Neal is honest in my opinion and Kenny claims he was asleep in the dressing room as he had flu and didn't know what was going on. Phil Neal and Alan Hansen said they were all made aware there were deaths but still agreed to play, Kenny says he had no idea people had died. Strange that

 

It's what you quoted Jay

They are contributory factors, the judge formed an opinion on those. There are letters from senior police that state these were factors. It's called opinion.

 

Phil Neal and Kenny Dalglish saying it was Combat 18 Chelsea supporters and not Liverpool supporters who were rampaging across the terraces?

 

I'm just a nosey cow, take no notice of me! You're the first person I have come across who was inside the ground that day. I know people who lived nearby who helped out after the event.

 

You stirer It's surely only a coincidence that two of the three biggest football disasters involving clubs from England, actually involve Liverpool I'm sure DavidCurriesLoveChild can show us proof that the Bradford City fire is linked to a scouser

 

When people say "Justice For The 96" they mean that ALL Scousers should be completely absolved from blame.

 

You are one of my favourite posters on here. I agree with you with the vast majority of issues. In fact virtually every post I nod my head to. But for some reason - IMO - you have a real blind sport when it comes to this topic, largely (it seems) predicated on a prejudicial opinion of Liverpool and Liverpudlians. I can't think (based on your usual posts) of any other issue where you would argue so vehemetly against all the available evidence, in favour of a position that is wildely accepted as a horrible attempt by the establishment to refocus the blame for the disaster by those who caused it - the highest levels of the police, civil service, and government - and you continue to perpetuate the same myths.

I won't for a second fall out with you over it, but I've always been very surprised by you uncharacteristic stance on it.