Is Lee Johnson right?

In your definition yes, not mine necessarily. As stated Higgy put plenty of effort in, he's far from ever being described as a grafter.

Let's just accept we see it differently.

 

So effort is when you bother.

Graft is bothering all the time.

According to you.

So LJ likes grafters.

Owt wrong with that?

 

Yes, I think so. Lots of Barnsley supporters love Winnall because of his obvious enthusiasm and passion.
I think he is a good finisher but doesn't have the pace or strength to go above L1.
A lot of BFC supporters are more critical of Pearson, who I think could play in the Championship.
When I used to go to matches regularly, no-one moaned about Gwyn Thomas, but they moaned about Steve Agnew, mainly because he wouldn't go into leg-breaking tackles, and yet Agnew was the superior footballer.

I also think we aren't a bad team, not too far away from being a good team, and I'm tired of all this criticism negativity ******** surrounding us at the moment. But then I've just got home from work, so I am tired full stop.

 

I'm making assumptions that LJ is suggesting we would love a team full of players like Perkins or Dawson which is completely wrong. Fans like these kind of players because they are seen as grafters but fans also like to see quality players such as Hignett who can change a game with a moment of brilliance. The problem with some of these quality players is that some of them (McCourt / Mellis) do absolutely nothing for long periods and in some cases don't put any effort into doing anything for games and a time in some cases. They don't need to have the kind of work ethic of a Dawson or a Sheridan but they are expected to break sweat and at least try. Mellis didn't, Hignett did. That is the difference in my opinion.

 

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with owt you think, just explaining how I see things. The OP was about LJ saying fans like grafters.

You knock yourself out if you want to get arsey about it though.

 

I can't do that cos I've made so much effort in this thread I feel as though i'm grafting!

 

for me effort is something every player should put in , ie if you have talent and you make the effort to use it by and large you will succeed more often than not, a grafter would be someone like Darren Sheridan, not the most talented but worked his ******** off to make up for what he lacked against more skilful payers.
If we don't like skilful payers how come sir Ronnie is revered so much (OK maybe by fans of a certain age) NOW THERE was a player with talent who did make the effort to get the best from his gift!

 

You expect effort from each player. We ought to expect it from minute 1 to 90, having regard to their wages.

Graft appears to be a dirty word. Some players need to run around more than others by virtue of their roles. Call it graft.

Call it effort.

 

No, he isn't. It isn't that we prefer 'grafters' to players with talent (as if they're mutually exclusive), it's that we won't tolerate players that won't put in a shift. I don't think we're any different from any other set of fans in that regard.

Like you say, that may mean we tolerate some bloody average players as long as they're clearly trying their best, but isn't that just realism at the level we're playing?

I don't know the context of the question/statement, but for LJ to raise it would suggest that he has some views on players being favoured in the current side because they are 'grafters,' which I find a bit odd. Apart from Hourihane in one or two games last season (which I found appalling), I haven't seen anyone given a rough ride for a perceived lack of effort. Is that his point?

 

OK soz.

I have asked on this thread for LJ's original quote on all this......just to understand what he actually said.

 

Lots of Barnsley fans like Winnall because he scores goals. His enthusiasm and passion are a bonus, but if he didn't score goals he'd be like Chris Dagnall - someone you're fond of, but know you need better than to progress.

Whether he can go above L1 is a different question, but we're in L1, and we need Winnall or someone like him to score goals while we're here.

Edit - as it happens, I think Winnall will get and deserve a shot at championship football at some point in his career.

 

Quote what he said mate before you decide whether he's right or not.

 

Mike chuffing Sheron !!! Nearly choked on my Dead Pony (that's a brewdog beer for the uninitiated)

 

But not as daft as you!

Your footballing knowledge could be written on the back of a penny black!!!

 

I'm basing the reply on what the original post reported. As I said, I don't know the context of the statement.

 

When I still have a near 3pm Oakwell hangover from a Friday night sesssion, a mental picture of Mike Sheron always comes to mind.

This reaction is obviously personal to me, based on a bad experience and wholly irrational...... yet persists.

I'm considering having "The last big Mike Sheron saw me off" on my gravestone.

 

Apparently we paid a million for Mr Sheron.
We could have had a reat piss up with that dosh and wouldn't have been any worse off!!
Dreadful footballer

 

Fair enough.

Hourihane being booed at that particular game that i remember was appalling.

Though he was indeed appalling.

He's been alot better recently.

 

I think it probably goes:

Skillfull player who put in effort
'Grafters'
Skillfull players who can't be arsed to give a ****.

 

Surely you cant label Sam Winnall as just a grafter? For me, Scowen and Crowley aside he's the one with the potential to go the highest up the football pyramid in his career. Personally Ive never seen why any decent player cant also show a little bit of effort in a game anyway. Someone mentioned Howard, he was a better technical player than any of our current midfielders (Crowley aside) and he always put a shift in.

I think the real problem with effort for me is the lack of it we have when getting men into the box.


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