Keir Starmer

That doesn’t make any sense Sheriff. Corbyn’s last manifesto was in 2019. The cost of living issues began in mid-2022 following the full scale invasion of Ukraine.

It was never a prevalent issue when Corbyn led the party.

 

You'd receive additional benefits in this circumstance.

(Don't disagree with your point by the way, it's just your example is incorrect)

 

The manifesto took no position on the 2 child cap. It’s removal is still party policy agreed at Conference.

 

The cap has been in place since April 2017.

 

LOL. You mean following the lockdown.

 

It doesn't matter what was agreed at conference. The manifesto was signed off by various people/groups and was put to the country. Keir Starmer is now Prime Minister of the country and won election on that manifesto. The 7 MPs also stood on that manifesto and got elected on it, they should have stood as independents if it was such a divisive issue for them. There's no room for people in the governing party who defy manifesto pledges in King's speech votes.

It absolutely is posturing. You only have to listen to what Starmer has said this week regarding the cap to understand that he is not a supporter of the cap but he isn't willing to spend £3bn on something which isn't costed in the manifesto. The cap won't be in place by the end of the parliament I'm certain of it. The 7 knew exactly what they were doing and what the consequences would be, but they'd rather mouth off from the opposition benches about single policy issues rather than work on the government benches and solve the greater issue of child poverty; reducing the cap on its' own won't solve anything. It's amateur politics and I'm glad we've got the grown ups in charge now who understand the real world.

Let's revisit this in 5 years and see that the cap will be gone and child poverty will be reduced thanks to a Labour government, not some attention seeking populists.

 

Your spot on and this has been a perfect opportunity to get rid of a few more left leaning Labour mp's' but the fact is it was a free vote and he had no right to remove the whip' he's a dictator and an all round wrongun.

 

I would have thought monies raised from the arms that the UK sell to Israel might have covered such as this. But then I suppose, there’s the cash the UK gives to Ukraine which probably neutralises that.

Makes you proud doesn’t it?

 

MPs don't know what they are voting on. It's a good job Martin Lewis is about.

 

Technically, the UK doesn't sell arms to Israel. British companies (under licence from the government) sell arms to Israel. Companies such as BAE. And the amount is a fraction of what you (and I) probably thought it was - £576m in total since 2008 and down to £18.2m last year from £42m in 2022.

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9964/

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...ael/export-control-licensing-data-31-may-2024

(and no, I don't support the sale of arms to Israel at this time)

 

I dont class wanting to scrap a policy that stops children eating and being clothed properly as stupid. If Labour MP's want to back a motion that seeks to end this austerity measure then good on them. Its a pathetic position for a Labour government to take and the scrapping if it could be funded if they so wished. Starmer playing tough, disciplinarian again. He shouldn't have withdrawn the whip - that's what's stupid. He's causing problems for further down the line.

 

Go and join the Tories Mr Kaht. Sounds like they appeal to you.
Edit: I know you're not a Tory really but this is Tory policy and it should go. All people calling for it to go should be applauded not condemned. There is always money there if needed. Government finances aren't like a household budget.

 

Where do we find out the full list of the 42 Labour MPs that abstained?

 

Voting on opposition motions against your own party's King's Speech, a confidence matter, in the full advanced knowledge that the whip would be removed if so, is the stupid behaviour I was referring to. The specific issue makes no difference to this.

As noted earlier, let's see which happens first between the policy being changed and these 7 MPs regaining the Labour whip.

 

A grown up post reflecting the grown up government we now seem to have.

 

Because it isn't the fault of the kid if one or both of their parents happen to be a scrounger. Some other people they will have been able to afford the child at the time but then their circumstances change due to losing their job or the health of themselves or their partner.

The other issue we have is those at pension age or around pension age come from families that generally are larger in size. That generation might have 4-5 kids whilst nowadays people may have 1-2.

So we need to give people an incentive to have large families or one day we are screwed with less tax payers around to fund pensions for an ageing population.

 

Yes, we'll see what happens in future. We'll also see when Labour manages to find money from somewhere for other measures that weren't in the manifesto. There's no magic money tree except when there is. And Ill use the word 'stupid' again to define Starmer. He shouldn't have withdrawn the whip. This is a 'country over party' issue and on this issue he should have been far more sensitive. A word behind closed doors would have been far more sensible. But no, 'I need to show how tough I am'. He's also been 'stupid' in international affairs by suggesting to the Ukrainians that it would be ok to fire UK missiles into Russian territory. Reckless and stupid but he looks tough again.

 

The 7 MP's are well known agitators. If they didn't know they'd lose the whip, they are immensely stupid.

I have little doubt that the cap will be modified, and I suspect in time universal credit will be massively reformed or even abolished. You pick your battles. The likes of the village idiot Burgon and Long Bailey just couldn't wait to give Labour an excuse to get rid of them and demonstrate their naivety.

Sadly, I don't think suspending them will be good in the long run, but if you choose to oppose the Kings Speech or a budget... You're toast.

 

But the Muslims have not been suspended for being Muslims. They have been suspended for going against the party whip. The fact that they are Muslims is irrelevant.