This manager isn't good enough

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by S.M., Sep 25, 2021.

  1. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    I could agree with you to be honest. But at the same time there's absolutely no doubt that the manager is massively underperforming, making bizarre decisions and not getting the best out of the squad
     
  2. red

    redrum Banned Idiot

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    We've lost one player since last season when we finished in the playoffs thats mowatt, dike was never our player. We've swapped a head coach who's enthisis was on playing the football in the opposition half to one who wants to play it mostly in our own half. I know where I think the blame lies.
     
  3. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Bizarre decisions yesterday for sure. Up until then not that many. Repeating that he was doesn’t make it true.
     
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  4. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Just because we didn’t own Dike doesn’t mean we didn’t lose a player in the squad. We still lost Matty James for the second half of last season, even though he was only on loan for the first.

    We’ve also lost Morris, Mads, and then the players bought to replace those departing plus those brought in to improve.

    Yesterday was Schopp’s first proper audition for me and he failed. But to keep going back to Val when I don’t know another manager in the world who plays that style, I’m not sure what that achieves? He was unique, and despite the wins and the season we had I still think it was 60/40, possibly even 70/30, in terms of supports being critical of the style of play. Suddenly some of those same people are now using him in every argument.

    Consistency is important.
     
  5. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    To the vast majority of fans playing Clarke oduor upfront is a bizarre decision, just because you think he's a striker for some reason doesn't make it any less bizarre to thousands of others
     
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  6. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    I don’t think he’s a striker. When have I said that? He’s also not playing as one.

    All I’ve done is highlight he wasn’t a LWB and that wasn’t his natural position. I’ve never said he’s good enough to start, or played well, but in the games he has started the only other options have been Vic or Thompson. I think yesterday showed why we haven’t been going with the former.

    Oduor also wasn’t terrible second half yesterday, nor has he been as dreadful as some have made out in others. In fact, our highlight reel of attacks is so limited Oduor would probably feature in 3/4 of the top ten.
     
  7. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    Well you said he hasn't made bizarre decisions, many of us think that's a bizarre decision
     
  8. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    But it’s the one decision that the many hang their hat on. It’s one player in the Starting XI when the options have been Vic or Thompson. So is it really that bizarre or is Oduor just turned in to the buzz word/whipping boy to support claims typed in the heat of the moment?

    Just probing rather than giving an opinion. I just don’t see how the word bizarre can be used when he’s done ok in certain games and the alternatives are probably worse.
     
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  9. red

    redrum Banned Idiot

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    I'm not saying we don't miss dike I'm just saying the head coach is a bigger miss because this one looks clueless, your saying this squad is worse than the one relegated under morais I disagree. Collins is one of the best keepers in the division made more good stops yesterday to keep the score down. Helik would get in any championship side, styles was the best lwb in the division last season but we now play him in center and he looks poor, Britain again looks a diffrent player under schopp to last season, palmer and benson i belive are good enough for this league aswell as cauley. I haven't included anderson and Morris as they aren't avalible but they are also good enough.

    Schopp had a good bunch to choose from yesterday team selection all wrong tactics all wrong toothless in attack yet again. The players body language said it all, aswell as schopps body language just stands there with his hands on hip asif he's mid macarena no connection to fans or players for me sooner he's gone the better.

    I find it laughable how people have gone from saying "we've had a hard run in to start" to "he's missing alot of players" to now "its the players they aren't good enough"
     
  10. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Why tell lies mate? I never said this team was better or worse than the one relegated at Derby. I said they’re not far off each other quality wise and you could argue either way.

    And you are saying we shouldn’t miss Dike because you’re trying, for some random reason, to claim he doesn’t count as a player we’ve lost.

    Interesting thing on Style, and I include myself in this, is that 90% of supporters wanted him to be played in central midfield. It’s not working out for him there, but it’s what the majority of us were demanding.

    Agree with you on some of your observations yesterday though.
     
  11. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    It's a pretty big decision and hasn't Cole been available too?

    You can add to that the decision to piss about at the back and to continue doing so when it wasn't working. The substitutions. Or the decision to lump the ball to Woodrow's head and make him the throw in target at his head too when he doesn't head a ball
     
  12. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Cole hasn’t been available every game. He was also ripped in to big time after the cameo at QPR - funnily enough by some of the same people who call starting Oduor bizarre but then question why Big Vic gets a start. Can you see where I’m going with this?

    Bizarre is trying to turn JCR in to a sweeper or central midfielder. Bizarre is starting Robbie Williams in central midfield against Sheffield Wednesday. Picking Oduor ahead of Vic, Thompson and Cole might not be everyone’s favourite pick (although would be interesting to do a poll) but it isn’t bizarre.
     
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  13. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    It's odd that you think playing a left back in midfield is bizarre but you think playing a left back at the right hand side of a front three is perfectly normal. It isn't. It's bizarre. We have an academy at the club. It has strikers in it. People who are paid to play up front. We sent killer out on loan. A striker. We have many options but instead a left back is chosen to play in the most opposite possible position on the pitch
     
  14. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    This would make sense if Oduor was a genuine left back.

    We’re on repeat now and you’ll never acknowledge what I’m trying to say so let’s leave it at that. I mean you’ve now tried to mention Miller - another one who was getting pelters. Consistency is important.
     
  15. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    What position do you think odour is by the way? I'm curious because I was under the impression he was a left back/stroke left winger (or to put it another way ideally suited as a left wing back)
     
  16. red

    redrum Banned Idiot

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    Well if I've read it wrong fair enough, but imo I don't think this is a side who should be playing so poorly with 1 win in 10 and 6 league goals, looking like relegation fodder. I belive we have a decent bunch and the head coach is holding us back with the style he wants to play.

    Schopp is always going to get compared to val as he's the previous head coach that happens.

    I agree but for me he hasn't looked right at center midfield all season we had Gomes,palmer on the bench styles could have played wing back instead of williams. We can't just keep playing him in center midfield in the hope he comes good.
     
  17. Fon

    Fonzie Well-Known Member

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    There are some really interesting points raised in here to be fair:

    - Alex Mowatt is overrated and wouldn't be wanted by any other side in the top half of the vision. Can we put that one to bed please?

    - Styles will move inside and into his natural position. I'm not sure that's correct either. He seems much more dangerous out wide. But most fans wanted that to happen, and now it has this is also Schopp's fault.

    - How many of our new signings does the Head Coach actually rate? Benson obviously, as he's straight back into the side. The same as Kitching. But Cole has played about an hour this season. Vita not sighted yet. Gomes a game. Oulare next to nowt. Issa even less. Who is making these decisions? Conway? If so, he might need to speak to his gaffer to see if he fancies them before we stump up the brass

    - To say we aren't weaker than last year is plain wrong. Mowatt, Dike, Morris and Anderson are all not playing regularly for us this year - and also Ismael isn't in the dug out (as at the minute, Schopp is inferior). Just because Dike wasn't 'our' player doesn't mean we just discount him and pretend he doesn't exist. That's lunacy. "Well we aren't weaker cos Dike was never our player". OK then, I must have imagined those goals he scored last season.

    - The style of play has reverted to a more possession based one. The jury is still out on this. We bullied teams last year, but then again we had the personnel to do so. We had Mowatt delivering balls to Dike and Morris to harass defenders. Now we're hanging Woodrow out to dry by making him look daft as he goes up against tall centre halves, when he isn't great in the air. He wants it to feet or a pull back.

    - Onto the topic of Woodrow. He clearly performs best when he's next to a Big Man (hairy arse preferable). His best goalscoring season was with Moore, and last year he had Morris and Dike providing the muscle. He was comparably poor when he had Chaplin and Brown up with him. Maybe there's something in this?

    - Brittain and Helik have underperformed compared with last season so far. Last year, Brittain was almost like an out and out right winger, and how he didn't score a few goals I'll never know. He was electric. Helik also scored a fair few, and seemed more assured. Maybe he is less confident in being asked to play a more possession based style. It'll be interesting when Mads returns, because his improvement with the 'Vertical' football was immeasurable. He was like a rabbit in the headlights under Struber.

    ---

    I think that's all I've got for the time being. Maybe yesterday was a wake up call. Maybe it's the continuation of a poor run that will end with Schopp leaving. Who knows? I hope it's the former. It's top early to tell though yet (in my humble opinion).
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2021
  18. 55&counting

    55&counting Well-Known Member

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    "Yesterday was Schopp’s first proper audition for me and he failed."

    I agree with much of what you post and, unfortunately, the above is accurate.
    I will aways preach patience and perspective but yesterday I think Marcus missed an opportunity to swing fans opinion. Another confused selection and a performance which lacked any real urgency.
    I was v disappointed that he didn't come over to the fans at the end of the game. 3000 for an away game is a great turn out and the team and him let us down.
    He did fail the audition. He has two more within a week now and he absolutely must show he is capable of motivating and organising this group to the appropriate level.
    I think Blackpool looked decent. They looked hungry. We didn't. They looked together. We didn't.
    On the way home we were debating what we'd do if we were in charge....trying to be objective ...my brother in law hit the head on the nail..."Bring them in on Sunday morning and make them all look in the mirror." Make them realise they're letting themselves and us down.
    Thought Kitchings brief post match interview was good in that it showed he was hurting. In this case the hurt can help us improve.
    They owe us. They owe us a massive upturn in performance.
    This has turned into a random rant. Apologies. Its borne out of frustration knowing that we have the quality to be in a better position after 9/10 games.
     
  19. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    I agree. But yesterday was the first time the match day squad looked competitive in my eyes. Gave me optimism. Foolishly.

    Despite what people like to believe, or label fellow supporters with, nobody has tried to defend Schopp and make him out to be Sir Alex. All they’ve done is point at reasons for the side struggling - mainly injuries and availability. That’s totally fair and it’s always a surprise when people gloss over this like it’s irrelevant. When those reasons aren’t there anymore, and we got a little of this yesterday with players returning, then those same fans will judge the manager on having better tools at his disposal.

    It’s not rocket science. You can’t brandish someone clueless when they’re performing with a mid table League One Match Day squad. But those same supporters won’t then blindly defend someone who isn’t performing. October was always going to be the month where we see the real Schopp - yesterday was a poor dress rehearsal for that.
     
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  20. stairfoot.red

    stairfoot.red Well-Known Member

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    So we've now got available 5 strikers and yet he still plays Odour up front instead of one of them. If it's not bizarre to play a bad LWB as a striker when you've strikers sat on the bench or at home then what is it. If he was scoring or making goals for others regularly then fine schopp's pulled of a masterstroke but he isn't and yet Schopp persists with him in front of others. If the 2 Belgians and Cole are worse picks than Odour in a front 3 we really are in deep ****.
     
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